Should Obama allowed to be president?

[Slik]

The President of the United States must be naturally born in the United States and be a citizen of the United States of America according to the consitution, Article ll, section l. Take a moment to verify this is you want.

Barry Soetoro, or Barrack Obama as you may be familar with was born in Kenya, Africa. As an Indonesian citizen you aren't allowed to have dual nationalities meaning it is impossible for him to be a citizen of the United States of America when he was born. You are also not allowed to change your name, his legal name still stands as Barry Soetoro according to Indonesian Law.

Obama has not yet supplied a valid birth certificate to prove he was born in the United States, what he has provided was a fradulant document with a falsified border and without a stamp of approval. Clear signs that the document never legally existed, yet this was never checked for such a position?

Should Barry Soetoro, or Barrack Obama if you would like, be removed of his post as President of the United States of America?

Debate.

[Relapse]

Where did you get this information? About name, birthplace, etc?

[z0mg beast]

This is crap that you learn from the american media. This is equal to the case where "onion.com" reported that justin beiber was a fake, and he was really a child molestor.

[Angel`]

Wtf is this serious.

Incorrect info, please post more than 3 sources that have this bullshit.

If not you should be banned becase I'm offended

[Relapse]

Wtf is this serious.

t


No its not, if you think for a second that somebody as influential as the President of the United States in getting away with Identity fraud you are dumb.

Not directed at you but directed at anyone who thinks so

Its not something to get banned over... + there was a time when all of this was going around around

[Slik]

Where did you get this information? About name, birthplace, etc?

This information is easily available on the internet, I've been researching this for the last week and have come across plenty of evidence for this. I strongly recommend researching into this. Here is a video showing various different things I have discussed Only the registered members can see the link. After you're done viewing it, look into facts behind the video.

[2kbarrows]

Why the hell are people posting non-sense in a Intelligent Debate?
I do not agree to his Presidency, Most imigrants can be sent away to their country, why is he different?

[Network]

Think you should research more before your start a debate. Making a debate with false information won't end well

[Relapse]

This information is easily available on the internet, I've been researching this for the last week and have come across plenty of evidence for this. I strongly recommend researching into this. Here is a video showing various different things I have discussed Only the registered members can see the link. After you're done viewing it, look into facts behind the video.

I think him becoming an Indonesian citizen is what confuses people. But his original birth certificate says that he was born in Hawaii in 1961, Hawaii became a US State in 1959. Which because of the 14 amendment(one that many are trying to get rid of now) he is a US citizen.


Why the hell are people posting non-sense in a Intelligent Debate?
I do not agree to his Presidency, Most imigrants can be sent away to their country, why is he different?

Most Illegal immigrants... Obama is legal.


Think you should research more before your start a debate. Making a debate with false information won't end well

I don't think that this is entirely false info so its completely possible but highly unlikely.

[clawz]

false information, any evidence off of youtube etc can be posted by anyone. I personally dont care about American politicians because they are all self centred, arroagant retards (referring to wiki leaks and the way its being handled). The question we should debate is whether people would make this fuss if he was white, after all the American citizens voted for an illiterate and frankly stupid president (George Bush) and virtually worshipped him during his presidency

[2kbarrows]

false information, any evidence off of youtube etc can be posted by anyone. I personally dont care about American politicians because they are all self centred, arroagant retards (referring to wiki leaks and the way its being handled). The question we should debate is whether people would make this fuss if he was white, after all the American citizens voted for an illiterate and frankly stupid president (George Bush) and virtually worshipped him during his presidency

Only the registered members can see the link.
Only the registered members can see the link.
Only the registered members can see the link.
Shall i post more site/sources?

[Dean]

He was elected for a reason, wasn't he?

Yes he should be allowed to be the President of the United States of America.

[Christopher]

I hope you realize, if you moved to this Country, and have/had a green card for 15 years (correct me if I'm wrong, it's been a while since I've looked at this statue.) You will become a United States Citizen. So, in a way; He is a Citizen of the USA. Name changed or not.

[Slik]

I think him becoming an Indonesian citizen is what confuses people. But his original birth certificate says that he was born in Hawaii in 1961, Hawaii became a US State in 1959. Which because of the 14 amendment(one that many are trying to get rid of now) he is a US citizen.

'...In addition to the automatic Indonesian citizenship granted to a child acknowledged as a "son" by an Indonesian male citizen, and the Indonesian citizenship listed in Obama's school records, Obama then traveled to a place where Americans weren't allowed to go, but citizens of Indonesia were. If he obtained an Indonesian passport on his trip in 1981, he effectively renounced any American citizenship he may have had and cannot serve as president (or "rule" as president, as members of his campaign have stated).'

I believe this is what really confuses people. It was disputed that you couldn't travel to pakistan using a US passport during the time in which he did. Also, on numerious occasions he could have ended lawsuits simply by proving a hardcopy of his birth certificate yet he didn't? Why?

[Slik]

I hope you realize, if you moved to this Country, and have/had a green card for 15 years (correct me if I'm wrong, it's been a while since I've looked at this statue.) You will become a United States Citizen. So, in a way; He is a Citizen of the USA. Name changed or not.

Must be naturally born in the United States, according to the consitution.

[Christopher]

Must be naturally born in the United States, according to the consitution.

I wasn't born in the United States, and I'm a Citizen of this country. So, I must be an illegal immigrant... Right?

Wrong. I've lived in the country for longer than 15 years. Legally, I am a U.S Citizen.

[Slik]

I wasn't born in the United States, and I'm a Citizen of this country. So, I must be an illegal immigrant... Right?

Wrong. I've lived in the country for longer than 15 years. Legally, I am a U.S Citizen.

You're not the president though, to be the president of the United States of America you must be both natually born in the United States and be a citizen of the United States.

[Dean]

Maya Soetoro was Barack's' half sister, so possibly he had a half brother that was named Barry and was twins? lol.

I don't really have anything to say in this topic, it's dumb imho.

[Relapse]

false information, any evidence off of youtube etc can be posted by anyone. I personally dont care about American politicians because they are all self centred, arroagant retards (referring to wiki leaks and the way its being handled). The question we should debate is whether people would make this fuss if he was white, after all the American citizens voted for an illiterate and frankly stupid president (George Bush) and virtually worshipped him during his presidency

You are dumb don't post here anymore if you think people worshiped George Bush,

+ Slik wouldn't post something without research and reason. Its a debate, to either prove him wrong or help him prove that hes right. And don't bring race into something you don't understand because race is the dumbest way out of situations



'...In addition to the automatic Indonesian citizenship granted to a child acknowledged as a "son" by an Indonesian male citizen, and the Indonesian citizenship listed in Obama's school records, Obama then traveled to a place where Americans weren't allowed to go, but citizens of Indonesia were. If he obtained an Indonesian passport on his trip in 1981, he effectively renounced any American citizenship he may have had and cannot serve as president (or "rule" as president, as members of his campaign have stated).'

I believe this is what really confuses people. It was disputed that you couldn't travel to pakistan using a US passport during the time in which he did. Also, on numerious occasions he could have ended lawsuits simply by proving a hardcopy of his birth certificate yet he didn't? Why?

The 14th amendment has many flaws which is why people want it to be ratified so bad now-a-days, one of its main controversies now is the exact situation that Obama is put in. Also I haven't read anywhere where it says his Indonesian passport was legal, so say that he had a false passport he would have never had to give up his american citizenship, while that would be a crime in itself it should have helped him retain American citizenship. Another flaw is the fact that if Obama was born in the US, his parents could become citizens too. ( this has been coined the term "Anchor Baby")


Do you know whether he traveled with family? I'm assuming hes around 19/ 20 at the time? And I can't find that much info on this situation.

[Slik]

You are dumb don't post here anymore if you think people worshiped George Bush,

+ Slik wouldn't post something without research and reason. Its a debate, to either prove him wrong or help him prove that hes right. And don't bring race into something you don't understand because race is the dumbest way out of situations

Thank you, I would like to clearify I am simply providing the evidence for this debate, I have not said I agree with it. I've gone through the evidence of each case gone through various difference sources and brushed up on different laws. The OP is a collection of things spread through the internet that I have researched. So before people tell me to research, I think you should do some yourself.

[clawz]

Only the registered members can see the link.
Only the registered members can see the link.
Only the registered members can see the link.
Shall i post more site/sources?

I don't really care, he clearly isn't an illegal citizen and clearly is an eligible president. But for the sake of the argument i will disapprove all of the sources mentioned;

Educate-yourself.org

So i decided to view some other topics that have been written about to see if the website is a cult or an educational source and within seconds i found these three articles:

The new world order (Only the registered members can see the link.)
Project blue beam (Only the registered members can see the link.)
U.S. Concentration Camps Exists...Don't Remain in Denial! (Only the registered members can see the link.)

Just look at the titles and decide whether you think this website is trust worthy

WikiPedia:

We've all heard of wikipedia the most popular online dictionary that anyone can edit and contribute to.

This particular quote is taken from wikipedia its self. "Wikipedia is open to anonymous and collaborative editing (Only the registered members can see the link.)"

Wikipedia doesn't have dedicated processionals to write their various pages but instead rely on mr and mrs average who may have a basic knowledge, once this information is put on wikipedia people think of it as being "100%" true although we all know that i is most likely wrong.

indonesiamatters.com

Is a website that offers news to literally promote that indonesia still matters, the news will obviously promote indonesia as superior to prove that it "does matter". Bias much? isn't it likely the details were altered or slightly changed in such away to bend the facts? Once again its up to you to decide whether this website is trustworthy or down right bias.

Call me racist if you want but i am, i have an underlined hatred towards America because any media we get in Britain is always bad. for example many people in Britain blame George Bush for starting the war in Iraq and Afghanistan and hate Tony Blair for following him. And lets dont forget Jamie Olivers American food thingy or something that showed us how arrogant most of the Americans were in Americas "fattest town" ;)

[Ikiliki]

He lives in America, so mentioning laws from Indonesia doesn't work out well.

[Relapse]

He lives in America, so mentioning laws from Indonesia doesn't work out well.

But if he was given Indonesian citizenship then that would void his American citizenship by birth.

[Slik]

Do you know whether he traveled with family? I'm assuming hes around 19/ 20 at the time? And I can't find that much info on this situation.

He apparently traveled with his uncle at the age of 21, i'll find sources for this and post.


He lives in America, so mentioning laws from Indonesia doesn't work out well.

Except Indonesia law states you can't have dual nationalities which would prevent him from being an American citizen.


But if he was an Indonesian citizen then that would void his American citizenship by birth.

Correct.

[Relapse]

Ok I just read here Only the registered members can see the link. that Obama traveled to Pakistan with a friend from college (as a college student) which could have been seen as not being a threat even though Pakistan was under military control. Travel to Pakistan in 1981 as a American was difficult and dangerous but also not impossible. It is said that he stayed with friends so that could also have given him help to enter the country whether it be legally or illegally.

Also I have never heard of that website until now, so its credibility is lost on me, but it does seem to have been put forth in a way that is factual.

[Slik]

Ok I just read here Only the registered members can see the link. that Obama traveled to Pakistan with a friend from college (as a college student) which could have been seen as not being a threat even though Pakistan was under military control. Travel to Pakistan in 1981 as a American was difficult and dangerous but also not impossible. It is said that he stayed with friends so that could also have given him help to enter the country whether it be legally or illegally.

Also I have never heard of that website until now, so its credibility is lost on me, but it does seem to have been put forth in a way that is factual.

I just came across that aswell, along with 4-5 different stories. All come from unstable sources, I also agree that it was possible to travel even if he did it illegally it doesn't affect his presidency.

[Relapse]

I just came across that aswell, along with 4-5 different stories. All come from unstable sources, I also agree that it was possible to travel even if he did it illegally it doesn't affect his presidency.

The whole thing is pretty shady though and I doubt that we could find one with 100% truth, or whether Obama wants to admit to the 100% truth.

We kinda need some other opinions here too :P

[clawz]

Please, some one disagree with my post to keep this argument alive lol.. this is turning more into a "lets work out the conspiracy" rather than "lets argue whether its true" :P

[Slik]

The most intresting thing out of everything I looked at was the fact that after 47 lawsuits against him, not once did he provide the hardcopy of his birth certificate which would have ended each and every single lawsuit instantly. Instead some dragged on for weeks, costing both parties which brings the question to mind, why didn't he provide the hard copy?

@ claws,

Educate yourself holds articles posted by various different users, some are greatly respected others are unheard of. You can find utter rubbish there, true but that doesn't reflect on that particular persons anaylsis.

indonesiamatters.com - The articles about this don't originate from the site so the information they are spreading isn't biased, the fact that they are holding one side of the story and not the other, fair do but the core information there is available from various different sources.

[Relapse]

Please, some one disagree with my post to keep this argument alive lol.. this is turning more into a "lets work out the conspiracy" rather than "lets argue whether its true" :P

To determine whether or not its "true" or not you have to find and know the "conspiracy" behind Obama's situation... You can argue all day about whether you think its true or not but eventually you are going to need facts and conspiracy(accusations) to prove your side or disprove the other.

Wikipedia also has a references section. Refer to those for "real" published articles not compilations of them.

[Ikiliki]

Hmmm, I see.
Ah well, he's a lot better then Bush in my opinion, so he has all the right to stay imo. I don't really care about having two nationalities, I have two myself yet my government doesn't like it.

[Ziek`]

Sorry bro. When you get into college, a YouTube video used as a source will be laughed at. There is hard evidence proving that Obama was born in Hawaii, so your argument is invalid.

[Matty]

Sorry bro. When you get into college, a YouTube video used as a source will be laughed at. There is hard evidence proving that Obama was born in Hawaii, so your argument is invalid.

Making a statement without backing it up? Provide a source at least otherwise your argument is invalid.

[Relapse]

Sorry bro. When you get into college, a YouTube video used as a source will be laughed at. There is hard evidence proving that Obama was born in Hawaii, so your argument is invalid.

You obviously don't understand Slik's argument.

[Slik]

Sorry bro. When you get into college, a YouTube video used as a source will be laughed at. There is hard evidence proving that Obama was born in Hawaii, so your argument is invalid.

The video isn't a source, more a summary of what I have discussed. The fact of the matter is Obama has never provided a hard copy of his birth certificate, so there is no hard evidence of him being born in Hawaii.

[Brayden]

THANKYOU SILK FOR POINTING THIS OUT, the us is now reviewing this as we have overlooked it in the past, THAT OR YOUR MAKING IT UP AND ARE CLEARLY A RETARD. nuffsaid.

[Matty]

THANKYOU SILK FOR POINTING THIS OUT, the us is now reviewing this as we have overlooked it in the past, THAT OR YOUR MAKING IT UP AND ARE CLEARLY A RETARD. nuffsaid.

Just leave. Don't come back to this topic with your moronic posts, if you do, I will punish you. Learn to debate properly.

[Relapse]

Thank you, I would like to clearify I am simply providing the evidence for this debate, I have not said I agree with it. I've gone through the evidence of each case gone through various difference sources and brushed up on different laws. The OP is a collection of things spread through the internet that I have researched. So before people tell me to research, I think you should do some yourself.


THANKYOU SILK FOR POINTING THIS OUT, the us is now reviewing this as we have overlooked it in the past, THAT OR YOUR MAKING IT UP AND ARE CLEARLY A RETARD. nuffsaid.

See Above Quote

Its a debate, if you knew anything you would know that this is/was entirely real. The only thing that is "made up" are some accusations and theories.